The Not Drinking Alcohol Today Podcast
Meg and Bella discuss the ups and downs of navigating an alcohol free life in Australia's alcohol centric culture. This highly rated podcast, featuring in Australia's top 100 self improvement podcasts, is a must for those that are trying to drink less alcohol but need some motivation, are curious about sober life or who are sober but are looking for some extra reinforcement. The Not Drinking Alcohol Today pod provides an invaluable resource to keep you motivated and on track today and beyond. Meg and Bella's guests include neuroscientists, quit-lit authors, journalists, health experts, alcohol coaches and everyday people who have struggled with alcohol but have triumphed over it. Our aim is to support and inspire you to reach your goals to drink less or none at all! Meg and Bella are This Naked Mind Certified Coaches (plus nutritionists and counsellors respectively) who live in Sydney and love their alcohol free life.
The Not Drinking Alcohol Today Podcast
Voice of Change, Foundation for Alcohol Education & Research CEO, Caterina Giorgi
Today we talk to Caterina Giorgi, the CEO of the Foundation for Alcohol Research and Education (FARE) about the crucial role FARE plays in Australia in commissioning research on alcohol harm and advocating for essential changes to Australia’s alcohol laws and policies. We cover a lot in this episode, including the alarming ways alcohol advertising targets young kids, how pervasive alcohol marketing is, the destructive effects of alcohol consumption across different demographics and the significant role alcohol plays in family violence. Caterina explains the manipulative tactics of alcohol companies, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic, and the powerful lobbying efforts that resist necessary regulatory changes to protect our most vulnerable communities from alcohol harm. We also discuss the changing landscape of alcohol consumption in Australia, celebrating the positive trends among young people who are increasingly choosing an alcohol-free lifestyle but also the troubling increase in alcohol-related health issues among older generations. Listen as we highlight FARE’s Voices of Change program, the success stories of community activism, and the ongoing need for advocacy to create healthier environments for everyone. Hear why organisations like FARE are crucial in amplifying the voices of those living with the consequences of alcohol harm and countering the influence of Big Alcohol and advocating for public health.
LEARN MORE ABOUT FARE
Web: https://fare.org.au/
MEG
Megan Webb: https://glassfulfilled.com.au
Instagram: @glassfulfilled
Unwined Bookclub: https://www.alcoholfreedom.com.au/unwinedbookclub
Facebook UpsideAF: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1168716054214678
Small group coaching: https://www.elizaparkinson.com/groupcoaching
BELLA
Web: https://isabellaferguson.com.au
Insta: @alcoholandstresswithisabella
Bi-Yearly 6-Week Small Group Challenges: Learn more: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/alcoholfreedomchallenge
Free Do I Have A Drinking Problem 3 Day Video Series: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/doIhaveadrinkingproblemwithisabellaferguson
Free Healthy Holiday Helper Email Series: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/o...
Today we are welcomed by Katerina Georgie, who is the CEO of the Foundation for Alcohol Research and Education, or FAIR. If you've ever Googled alcohol in Australia or you're in the coach or counselling space and you work in alcohol and other drugs the field, then you would definitely have come across FAIR and the brilliant programs and research that they do. So I'm really keen to learn a lot about FAIR and all the work that you're doing. A huge welcome, katarina.
Speaker 2:Hey Bella, Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1:You're really welcome. So when I look at FAIR, I can see that you have tentacles far and wide in terms of research and gosh appearing in the media and programs. Would you mind giving us a rundown on what FAIR does?
Speaker 2:I would love to. So I absolutely love this organisation. Fair is a national charity and we work in a range of areas, so one of the things that we do is we elevate the voices of people with lived experience in advocacy, in sharing stories about the many ways that alcohol impacts on people's lives. We do a lot of policy and advocacy work, so trying to investigate and understand different approaches to prevent and reduce alcohol harm, because that is the aim of the organization, the vision of the organization and why we exist. We also do health promotion campaigns, so we have lots of resources and information on our website and we do campaigns on alcohol and pregnancy and we've got some really exciting campaigns that we're going to launch over the coming years as well, talking about alcohol and mental health and a range of other things that people who would listen to these are probably well aware of.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank you. And look, I've certainly found a lot of your research Incredibly useful. Gosh, there was the research that FAIR had done that just showed the walked through the average life of a teenager and what advertising around alcohol that would hit them in terms of social media advertising on billboards, on TV, and gosh, I looked at this a long time ago but I think it was you know, an ad every 15 seconds promoting alcohol.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think this is the thing. It's everywhere. Yeah, so you know, we're in this situation at the moment across Australia and across the world, where every phone is a bottle shop and a billboard and it's completely inescapable and our kids see it too. So kids are just being pummeled with this advertising and we do a lot of work with our colleagues in the gambling and unhealthy food space and it's across all of these different areas, and we know, when it comes to alcohol advertising, that the earlier that kids are exposed to advertising, the more likely they are to start drinking earlier and to drink at riskier levels.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's frightening. As a mum of two teenage boys 15 and 16, it certainly frightens me, but so we've opened the chat quite early, given my backstory as well, and I was going to ask this question later on, but it kind of segued nicely in here now, which is gosh. The other bit of research that I just was so fascinated in. I think you had tapped into international research which just showed that kids as young as four are actually picking up on their parents drinking in terms of the smell or change in behavior. That floored me, absolutely floored me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there are kids in early learning centres, so really little kids, who say things like there's mum's gin glass. They're really identifying what's happening and they're watching the modelled behaviours and they're watching that from so early on. And you know, anyone who has kids or is around little kids is just so conscious of how clever they are and how much they pick up because they're learning so rapidly. And of course, that's the same for what their parents are drinking, because they're noticing, they're watching, and particularly for their parents, who they're so connected to.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I can rattle off so many mums that have had. You know, they've gone into the primary schools and their kids have drawn pictures of their mum doing their favourite thing and there they are holding a wine glass and it's just, oh no, yeah, it's kind of frightening stuff, isn't it?
Speaker 2:I think it's just about. You know, we just have to be. We are super aware that alcohol is everywhere and I think that I think it's really important for us to acknowledge that we don't live in a vacuum. We don't live in a box away from everybody else. We live in a broader environment and the environment that we live in is one that says if you're having a bad day, you drink. If you're having a good day, you drink. If you're celebrating, you drink. If you're commiserating, you drink. If it's a Friday, you drink. And so all of those messages just make it so normal and normalize it so much that you know we might not reflect then on what that might mean or what it might, how it might be received, particularly by the little people in our lives.
Speaker 1:Yeah, which I've kind of jumped ahead. So I just wanted to ask you what brought you to this role, what attracted you to it, what was the kind of backstory that made this a really good fit?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's an excellent question, Bella, because I have now spent more than a quarter of my life at FAIR.
Speaker 1:Ah, you've done so much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is my second time here in this role and in my first stint, when I was here 15 years ago, things were very different, so it's always interesting to see the way that things change. But I, as I said earlier on, I love this organization. I'm so connected to it.
Speaker 2:You know, I've done a lot of work across the not-for-profit sector and I think one of the things that consistently comes up is the harm that alcohol causes and the way that that just goes across so many social and health areas. Its contribution to things like homelessness, poverty, violence, as well as the impact on health harms, and I think that you know this is something that governments can do something about. So there are tangible actions that can be taken. There are also, you know, some really large corporations who are actively doing all they can to increase their sales, particularly to people who are most vulnerable and to people who are doing it tough, and so I just really want to be part of this wonderful independent organisation, part of this movement of people who are wanting to see a change to that, and that's what has attracted me to FAIR and just keeps me coming back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're lucky to have you, and I guess you're right. You have to throw a lot of research, a lot of money, a lot of time and expertise against to sort of just chip away at all the efforts and the money that big alcohol has in just their very tricky ways of advertising to our youth. And well, yeah, it goes far and wide, doesn't it? Do you mind if I ask you this question, Because I know a lot of our listeners always want to know what's your relationship with alcohol like?
Speaker 2:Sure. So at this stage in my life I drink alcohol very occasionally and the reason why is because I have small children and I'm also about to turn 40 and I value most in my life sleep, and if I drink alcohol it really disrupts sleep like even small amounts, and I just I want sleep more than it. I think I find with sleep that you don't realize how important it is until you can't get enough of it, and I value that more than anything else and I just want to have as much energy as well to, you know, be there for my kids and to also give as much as I can to this job and to our community here at FAIR. And I just find that I do that much better if I'm not drinking alcohol.
Speaker 1:Oh yes, that is one of the main driving forces behind my decision never to really contemplate going back to drinking, because there's nothing better than that good, solid sleep you get alcohol free. Nothing better than that good solid sleep you get alcohol free. So FAIR jumps into a lot that you think has been sort of a real pioneering effort or some of the most important research that's revealed a lot about alcohol and particularly Australia's relationship to alcohol generally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, bella. I think there are so many possible answers to this, because over the 20 years that FAIR has existed, we've been really fortunate enough to shape and be part of and drive research in a range of areas. I think one of the areas that's been really important and this started, it would have been 15 years ago now was looking at the impacts of alcohol on people around the drinker.
Speaker 1:So it was looking at.
Speaker 2:How does this impact on kids? How does it impact on, you know, women, on communities, and I think I've found some things that most of us, when you speak to people in the community, are quite aware of or go. I'm not surprised, but it really quantified that and also explained different people's experiences. So you know, it shows that almost one in five kids are negatively impacted by the drinking of a pet.
Speaker 1:Oh, it's so high it's so high?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and when it comes to things like alcohol's involvement in family violence, you know, we know that police reported data, for example, shows that between 23 and 65% of incidents reported to police of family violence involve alcohol, and so I think it shows all of the different ways that alcohol ripples through the community and all of the different ways that it contributes to harm to people across the community, and I think that that's it's really important, because we really need to understand, you know, all of the all of the ways that people are being negatively impacted so that we can try and change that. That's right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%. I think. The other thing is there's a study that shows that alcohol companies sell 36% of alcohol to 5% of people.
Speaker 1:Yes God, that hits hard, that statistic, doesn't it?
Speaker 2:I think it's astounding, because when you combine that with research that we now have that shows that alcohol marketing is super tuned and hyper-targeted towards people who drink at the highest risk levels, it becomes even more concerning. And so these companies, particularly as more and more people are exploring, you know, this sober, curious movement and cutting back on drinking, they're relying more and more on pushing these products into people who were drinking at the highest levels. And so I think it points to the behaviours that are allowed by these alcohol companies to target people who are, you know, at their most vulnerable, at the highest risk, experiencing the most harm, causing the most harm. All of the things across the spectrum.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what are some of the more sneaky or underhand behaviours that you're picking up on that alcohol advertisers are doing to try and get that extra money from the people that are most vulnerable?
Speaker 2:What do you think? So what happens is that, if you think about the fact that everything we do online provides a profile so who we're, with the interactions that we have, where we go all of this data is collected to go into a data soup, and so you know. We've heard examples of people being pushed different products at different times in the day depending on who they are. So for women, who might be at greater risk, they start getting sold or pushed particular ads after school drop-off and it changes throughout the day depending on what might happen. Ads after school drop off, and it changes throughout the day depending on what might happen. We've seen examples of people getting EDMs which are like newsletters that say you know, it looks like you're taking a break from alcohol. Here's a discount to try and sell you more. We've seen super targeted advertising that's like you bought a bottle of vodka at this time last week, we're now going to sell you two and here's a big discount.
Speaker 2:So really predatory approaches and tactics. But on top of that, it's just this insidious way that they normalize alcohol as well, the way that they tap into the different norms that are going on. So once people started, you know watching a lot more subscription television at home. Then they started advertising. You know, to enjoy that better, you need to drink alcohol. Once COVID hit, you know, we did an analysis that found a hundred, more than a hundred ads, or an ad every 35 seconds over the course of an hour, and these ads set. Three quarters of them were COVID themed. So it was like to get through isolation, you should drink alcohol. They were even selling isopax, which was a bottle of wine for every day of isolation, when isolation used to be 14 days. So it's just really predatory approaches and a lot of it we don't see because it's targeted to specific people at specific moments and there's no accountability or transparency around the way that they develop these models.
Speaker 1:Oh, it's absolutely horrible behaviour and I wish there were tougher laws on advertising. I know that the laws that we have at the moment are kind of toothless tigers they kind of. I think, from what I know, it's up to the advertisers themselves to kind of monitor, so there's got to be some toughening up. It doesn't make sense, well, except for the tax benefits that go, I guess, to government. But yeah, it's frightening.
Speaker 2:It is. And I think one of the things that I see quite a bit, bella, in my work is just the nature of the lobbying, and if ever there is any prospect that laws are changed or strengthened, they really ramp up. So really large alcohol companies and their lobby groups really ramp up their activity. So they fought against pregnancy health warnings being on alcohol products for 20 years, which is astounding. And then, once that was introduced, you know, there were very senior public servants who worked for the agency that implemented the labels who lost their jobs.
Speaker 2:And I heard of lobbyists going around Canberra saying, you know, we've taken two scalps, like it's this sort of pressure that's applied. And what happens then, if that pressure is consistently applied, is that topics get named as being, you know, off limits, and so people stop, public servants stop recommending changes. Advisors, you know, say this is something that we can't touch politically, politicians don't want to go anywhere near it because of these threats and this risk to this broader environment. So the power is significant and I think that another reason why having an organisation like FAIR and the community around this organisation is because without it, the only voices that are communicating to decision makers are lobbyists. Yes, and they have a really big vested interest.
Speaker 1:Oh, I wish that there was more, I guess, publication of these sorts of stories so that we knew, because that's sort of just that's really frightening, really frightening. And just on that advertising theme, I remember seeing in terms of what they're doing to target kids is on Facebook and their social media feeds they're getting influencers that are not allowed to really promote alcohol. I know that there is a law against that, but they're doing it in other sort of subliminal ways of promoting a drink to kids which just sinks in sort of behind the scenes. It's promoting that kind of happiness, confidence, fitting in connection, and yeah, it just scares me so much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they think about it. From product development and we saw this with you know they were trying to increase. There's a lot of alcoholic products that are designed to be targeted towards young women and you can think of the type of ones that they are the lolly type, vodka drinks, and I won't use any brand names, but we can all picture them now. And then they were like we need more products to target boys. And so this is where this lemon soft drink, whose name I won't mention, where the hard product around that popped up. So it's a really conscious decision of what are young boys drinking? They're drinking this lemon soft drink. How can we make it appealing to them? And the companies? Um, the companies are. They are actively trying to increase markets in these various spaces to try and increase sales, and we don't see it, and I think it's because we also don't see the alcohol industry like the tobacco industry. But a lot of the tactics they're adopting are the same.
Speaker 1:It's amazing that you know Ireland has been able to get a change to their laws and their labels. I would have thought that would have been a harder job to do than Australia, but it turns out not.
Speaker 2:I wish we could get there. Yeah, it's, you know, and that continues to be something that's discussed and at risk, because once these policies are up, it doesn't necessarily mean that they hang around either. But no, our counterparts, they do an amazing job and they've done amazing advocacy, and if you look at the rates of death and liver disease and alcohol-associated diseases in Ireland, it's really significant. But yeah, I think that we need to talk more about this happening, because when decisions by governments are made, they're making a choice. So they're choosing to support these large alcohol corporations and their lobbyists or they're choosing to prioritise the health, safety, wellbeing of kids, families, communities, and we have to keep communicating that, because I just think that, you know, I haven't met anyone who doesn't have a story about how alcohol has negatively impacted someone in their life, and it's just, it's everywhere, and we need to do more to try and prevent it, because it is preventable, oh look me too, and I love it.
Speaker 1:When I see you, Kat, on the media, on TV or there's an alcohol issue and they've gone to you for a quote, I always like, I cheer and just think, yes, thank God they've got somebody there that is immediately able to, you know, be informed and counteract the headline that is coming up from big alcohol. There is a lot of change happening in the sober curious movement, the Sober Curious movement. There's a rise of podcasts in Australia that are promoting an alcohol-free life. There's a lot of change. Are you feeling that there is a growing drink-less movement and what are your thoughts around that? And I guess the follow-up question is well, what do you still feel is a problem statistically in Australia that really needs to be addressed quite quickly?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think it's always really important to point out the positive trends that we're seeing, and we're seeing a really positive trend among young people. Back when I was 18, 70 to 80% of young people so people under 18 were drinking alcohol. The rates of higher risk drinking were really high, and now that's flipped to 30% of young people under 18 are drinking alcohol. So it's this huge change over 20 years which I think is great and really positive.
Speaker 2:The sober, curious movement was not a thing when I started at FAIR in 2010 for the first time. It just the thought that people would come out and say I am choosing not to drink alcohol, or I'm choosing to cut back on alcohol, or I'm choosing to drink less alcohol because it's better for my health, it's better for my wellbeing, I'm feeling sharper, it's better for my mental health, I love sleeping better. Just the thought that people would celebrate that and then be celebrated for that was so far removed from where we were. So I think it's great to see that and I get so excited when I see it, and I love podcasts like yours that celebrate it as well. I think that when you've got this risk factor that occurs among so much of the population, you know, 70 to 80% of people. You're going to see so many different subcultures, and so I think we should celebrate these great things, but I don't want it to mask the fact that this is still such a significant contributor to death and disease in Australia. And all of these things can be true at once. So it can be true that we're seeing more people who are not drinking alcohol, but we're also seeing the highest rate of alcohol induced deaths in a decade Gosh, yeah. And we're seeing increases in hospitalizations in people seeking treatment for alcohol, hospitalizations in people seeking treatment for alcohol. We're seeing increases in liver disease among, you know, particularly hospitalizations, particularly among women in their forties. Yeah, we're seeing deaths. The highest increase in deaths for those rates of deaths that I mentioned was for women who were between 45 and 65 who had liver disease. It wasn't something we saw before.
Speaker 2:So there are these subcultures, you know, by far in those statistics I should really point out and these are people, and each of these people have families and communities, but it's largely men still. But there are these pockets of trends here that are happening across the board and we need to make sure that we're not generalizing about a culture, because there are multiple subcultures, and so there's this big question around well, is this approach to digital marketing? There are alcohol retailers who are boasting about wanting to be the Netflix of alcohol and really knowing what people think or what they want before they even think it, and then just bombarding them with marketing. Is that, and the rapid expansion of delivery, increasing chronic disease? Is it that women's bodies because this is the first time that we've seen women who were drinking at higher risk levels reach these older ages?
Speaker 2:And for people in my age group who were at that highest risk of binge drinking, they've continued to drink at higher risk levels, but just in different ways now. So is that what we're seeing here? Is it that we don't know enough about liver disease in women, because a lot of the studies on that have traditionally been in men, because that's who've had the diseases? So there's lots of questions to be asked, but certainly some really problematic trends that we're seeing that often get buried or overlooked, because there's this conversation about some of the positive trends we're seeing, which we should be celebrating.
Speaker 1:Gosh, that was so interesting just to hear the different little subsets there that are increasing. And I'm certainly one that falls in that age bracket between you know, the ages of 40 and 60. I'm nearly 50. And that's my client base as well. It's our listeners as well. Our listeners tend to be within that age group, men and women. We're Gen Xers, we're the ones that were part of that grunge culture way back in the 90s, I think, where it was quite self-destructive. We were the ones that really were advertised to. We were sort of part of that early phase of when the big alcohol turned their heads and said, okay, there's another dollar, they've got just as much money there, let's do the pink advertising. And I wonder, yeah, if we've just kept on going and going and going. And now we're part of that 40 to 60-year-old group where we're finding it really hard to stop.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and equally, the reason why we're still seeing higher risk and rates of drinking among the generation above that, like into 60s and 70s, is because they just have continued those trends as they've gone through and continued to be marketed to and throughout their lives this has been the norm, um, and so I'm. I'm really pleased to see a shift in norm among young people. When I speak to some, um, young people who are in their teens, who say things to me like why would anyone ever get so drunk that they don't know where they are, and I just think to myself the norm was reversed. When I was in my teens, it was like lots of people get that drunk, and so there have been some, you know, positive shifts and I hope, I think that we need to, we have to try and do all we can to maintain that shift as they continue to grow and we're starting to see a slight reversal of that, particularly in girls and young women.
Speaker 2:What do you mean by that? So in the most recent National Drug Strategy Household Survey, it found that teenage girls or young women they were starting to increase the rates of drinking and that was the first time we'd seen that they didn't observe it in any of the other population groups. So and that to me you know that's a concern. So we need to try and preserve this and extend it and then try and also look at ways that we can support people in other groups Because the thing I hear from the group that you've mentioned is the listening group for this podcast is that whole notion of that slippage. Like I was getting home, I was having one drink and then I just looked back and that one drink had turned into a bottle and the bottle was happening every day and so it becomes this really unhealthy routine. But it's a norm and everyone's telling you it's a norm and the marketing's telling you it's a norm and everyone's telling you that's the way you cope and that's the way you get by and it's fine until it's not.
Speaker 1:And then suddenly it's right at that time when you suddenly you're feeling looking unhealthy. There's sort of a fork in the road for you at that age group too, because your kids are getting older, they're leaving and you're kind of, you're trying to work out well, how do I want to want to live the rest of my life? I'm going to continue on this trajectory and then to untangle yourself from alcohol at that age is really bloody hard. In my house I've got two stepdaughters. They're 24, 27, and they're certainly part of that younger statistical movement that you're referring to where it's increasingly more viable to say no, and I'm so proud of them. I often sit around dinner when they're offered a glass of wine. They're just like no, no, can't be bothered. I'm just thinking, gosh, that is so cool. At that age I would have been like, sure, sure, I'll have a glass, but you're right, yeah it didn't feel like an option no it just was not, the allure of it was just oh, it's a special drink and you're right.
Speaker 1:If we can preserve it and continue that on, that would be incredible, because the ripple then affects for all their relationships and their kids the health system.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's a no brainer, it's a no brainer. It certainly feels that way and I think that you know I love, love, love public health frameworks, and so you're going to hear the nerdy health part of me. But I just I loved learning about the Ottawa Charter, which is this structure that talks about how you can shift environments and it helps to create positive health trends, and of course, that makes sense. So if you build more paths, people will walk more. If fruit and veg is cheaper, people will buy more fruit and veg, and so I just I'd love to see an environment that enables less drinking, an environment that enables socialization connection coming together, that isn't focused around drinking alcohol, and governments that prioritise that. That don't, you know, turn around and say well, the only way we can have, you know, social gatherings is to subsidise alcohol.
Speaker 2:I'd just love to see more of a focus, and we know that it can be done because we see it done all the time. We've seen it with seatbelts in cars, you know. The car industry said that it would go broke if seatbelts were put in. All of these things we've been through, and so if governments can choose health, then we can help to enable these. You know, create these environments that enable healthier behaviours.
Speaker 1:It's good leadership, isn't it? I mean, really, that's what it comes down to. The stats are there. It's good leadership, isn't it? I mean, really, that's what it comes down to. The stats are there. It's good leadership. What are you most proud of that FAIR has done or is doing?
Speaker 2:I was just saying to our team this morning in our staff meeting how proud I am to be part of this team and to be part of this community. I think one of the things that I'm most proud of in recent years is our Voices of Change program. I'm so proud of FAIR acting as an engine room for people who have experienced harm from alcohol and want to see change, and just I feel really fortunate to be able to sit with people and to just say here are all the things FAIR does, what change do you want to see and how can we help you to enable to see that change? Just the advocacy, the meetings, people sharing their stories, all of the things that help to communicate that this is a common experience. Everyone's experience is different and it's individual, but the common experience of having been impacted by harm is something that so many of us feel and so you know you're not alone. There is this community and let us help you. What are the ways we can help? And an example of this is when I first started at FAIR.
Speaker 2:I went up to Darwin and I sat down with Aunty Helen in the Bagot community near Darwin, and it was at the time when Woolworths was trying to build one of the biggest bottle shops in the country, near Bagot, and Aunty Helen was trying to stop it. And I said I was like can we help? And she said to me, yes, she said I know that when people down south know about this, that it will have to stop. And I just remembered reflecting and being like, firstly, aunty Helen's an incredible advocate, yeah. And secondly, to think to myself, we can like, we can do that, we can, we can help to. You know, connect Aunty Helen with the media. We can help to show that this isn't okay. And then to to be able to support communities like Aunty Helen and organisations in Darwin that worked alongside her to stop that. It's those types of activities and it's just by listening to people and asking the question of how can we help. That's what I'm most proud of, that FAIR does Life-changing, life-changing stuff.
Speaker 1:What does FAIR have on the horizon? What do you have in the pipeline that you really want to do if you had all the funding in the horizon? What do you have in the pipeline that you really want to do if you had all the funding in the world? And I know that you're doing a Sea to Surf. I don't know what is it campaign or run?
Speaker 2:Yeah fundraiser that's the word I'm looking for. Yeah, yeah, yeah, there are 20 of us, including me and my nine-year-old daughter who are? Doing the City to Serve.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, I'm sure it will be character building for both of us who are doing the City to Serve to help to raise funds for FAIR and for our Voices of Change program.
Speaker 2:So if people can help, then any donations are very welcome and appreciated. I think that, in terms of you know, looking forward, I'm really really excited to continue this Voices of Change work. I think it's really critical. I'm really excited to I feel really strongly about values-based health promotion campaigns where we're connecting with people based upon shared values and experiences that aren't fear and aren't stigmatizing like health promotion campaigns of the past. So, continuing to do that work and the impacts that it's having, it's really great to see that through things like our Every Moment Matters campaign on alcohol and pregnancy.
Speaker 2:So I'm excited to expand some of that work and I think I'm also. I also want us to keep expanding and being part of the areas that are often not seen, don't have visibility unless organisations like FAIR help to shine a light on it, and one of those areas is the role of alcohol and family violence. And certainly, yeah, with women coming to me and sharing that, you know the sound of the delivery truck to their home was the prompt for them to enact a safety plan to keep their kids safe. Like I feel a real sense of responsibility to make sure that those voices are elevated and heard and that governments act to do all they can to help to prevent that violence.
Speaker 1:I heard you on the radio actually when I was driving around in Adelaide. I heard you on the radio actually when I was driving around Adelaide when there were some really concerning deaths of women at the hands of men who were under the influence and, yeah, lots of information there that I just wasn't fully aware of. I mean it.
Speaker 2:I think we often don't think about the commercial drivers of violence.
Speaker 2:You know that there are companies that are profiting off increasing these rates of harms. When these companies choose to push and sell rapidly more alcohol to people who are drinking at the highest risk levels, when they choose to go around the country and try and stop any law change that will help to make a difference, I think we have a responsibility to call that out and to do all the things. Increase funding for services, increase awareness, increase support all of the things. We should be throwing absolutely everything at that, because it's a national emergency and it's a national disgrace.
Speaker 1:There has to be a duty of care there to some extent for our lawmakers and decision makers when it comes to the extent to which they want to prevent just unbridled access to alcohol by deliveries and at all hours. I mean, the disconnect is quite I'm dumbfounded by it why it isn't elevated.
Speaker 2:Yeah and Bella, this is someone said to me and it's really stuck with me. They said that if governments don't better control the accessibility of alcohol, then it falls on women to have to do that. And an incredible advocate, kim Valentine, who's shared her experience. She says believing us is the strategy. And I just think listening, and then you know if we're hearing from people if alcohol wasn't sold as late into the night, into homes, because as the sun goes down things get much worse, if they're saying that we should listen and you know, and what does it matter? Like to stop the sale of delivery of alcohol after 10 pm, like if these aren't, they're not huge things. So we have to push on governments to do it. We also have to call out the companies and lobbyists who are trying to stop those law changes from happening as well.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:So there's a lot of work to do, but I'm super hopeful because I just am surrounded by incredible people across the community who want to see this change in a way that I've never seen it before.
Speaker 1:Kat, it has been an absolute pleasure to talk to you, one of my most favourite conversations for a long time. I'm conscious of the time and I know that you're very, very busy, but honestly, just thank you so much for all the incredible work that you are doing at the helm of FAIR. Thank you.
Speaker 2:Thank you, bella, and thank you for your work in normalising these conversations and creating these communities. It all really makes a difference.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it all helps to work together, doesn't it, in the long run, Kat? Thank you so much Thanks.
