The Not Drinking Alcohol Today Podcast
Meg and Bella discuss the ups and downs of navigating an alcohol free life in Australia's alcohol centric culture. This highly rated podcast, featuring in Australia's top 100 self improvement podcasts, is a must for those that are trying to drink less alcohol but need some motivation, are curious about sober life or who are sober but are looking for some extra reinforcement. The Not Drinking Alcohol Today pod provides an invaluable resource to keep you motivated and on track today and beyond. Meg and Bella's guests include neuroscientists, quit-lit authors, journalists, health experts, alcohol coaches and everyday people who have struggled with alcohol but have triumphed over it. Our aim is to support and inspire you to reach your goals to drink less or none at all! Meg and Bella are This Naked Mind Certified Coaches (plus nutritionists and counsellors respectively) who live in Sydney and love their alcohol free life.
The Not Drinking Alcohol Today Podcast
Eliza Parkinson taking fear out of Triggers
What if the secret to overcoming addiction lies not in avoiding triggers, but in facing them head-on? Join us for an insightful conversation with the ever-inspiring Eliza Parkinson as we challenge the conventional approach to recovery from alcohol. Eliza shares her unique perspective on managing triggers with intention and care, drawing parallels to cognitive behavioral therapy techniques. Together, we explore the transformative power of gradual exposure, allowing individuals to cultivate self-trust and diminish the hold alcohol may have over their lives. Our discussion highlights the importance of taking small, deliberate steps to avoid isolation and embrace a life full of meaningful and fulfilling experiences.
As the episode unfolds, we shift our focus to the art of socializing without alcohol—a seemingly daunting task for many on the path of recovery. We arm our listeners with practical strategies for navigating social situations, emphasizing the significance of preparation and visualization. By imagining yourself confidently declining a drink or managing cravings, you can set the stage for success. Eliza and I explore the idea that connection is a powerful antidote to addiction, urging listeners to maintain social bonds while embracing the discomfort that often accompanies growth. We remind you that pushing beyond your comfort zones can lead to enriched life experiences and sustained friendships.
We close our discussion by diving into the importance of community in the recovery journey. Eliza opens up about her experiences finding supportive spaces that celebrate both individuality and inclusivity. Whether through online groups or face-to-face connections, the sense of belonging and emotional support offered by these communities is invaluable. Drawing inspiration from resources like Laura McCallum's "Push Off From Here," we underscore the healing power of vulnerability and acceptance. As we invite you to share your own stories and connect with us, we hope to foster a supportive network for all who are navigating the complexities of recovery.
MEG
Megan Webb: https://glassfulfilled.com.au
Instagram: @glassfulfilled
Unwined Bookclub: https://www.alcoholfreedom.com.au/unwinedbookclub
Facebook UpsideAF: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1168716054214678
Small group coaching: https://www.elizaparkinson.com/groupcoaching
BELLA
Web: https://isabellaferguson.com.au
Insta: @alcoholcounsellorisabella
Bi-Yearly 6-Week Small Group Challenges: Learn more: https://www.isabellaferguson.com.au/feb-2025-challenge
Free Do I Have A Drinking Problem 3 x Video Series: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/offers/JTFFgjJL/checkout
Free HOW DO I STOP DRINKING SO MUCH Masterclass: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/offers/7fvkb3FF/checkout
Online Alcohol Self-Paced Course: ...
Hey guys, welcome to the podcast Today. I'm really excited to have my friend Eliza on. Eliza Parkinson and I have had her on before. If you want to listen to her story, it's episode number 84, but I'd love to welcome Eliza back. Hey, how are you going?
Speaker 2:Hey, hi, megan, I'm so happy to be back, so happy to be back on your putty.
Speaker 1:Eliza's over in Canada and yeah, across the world, we are uniting.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 1:Very exciting.
Speaker 2:That's right. I know getting a time where we can talk together is always interesting.
Speaker 1:Yes, it is. It's fun because Eliza and I also work together, so we are constantly looking at time differences.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I have that like bookmarked the Australia Canada Eastern time zone thing bookmarked on my computer. Yeah, yeah same same. Because we talk almost every day now.
Speaker 1:Yes, we do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so what should we talk about today? I was thinking about, like I've been thinking a lot about triggers, uh-huh, yes.
Speaker 1:I love that.
Speaker 2:In the sort of recovery world which I don't even like, using the word recovery, sober, alcoholic, I don't use any of those worlds, but I was thinking about in the general, like recovery world, the sorry, I tripped over my tongue that being triggered is something that people are told very early on to avoid. Avoid your triggers. Avoid them, you know. Or a natural instinct comes in where we're trying to self-protect ourselves because we don't want to be triggered. Bars or pubs, uh, to the movies, to um a party, uh, like a, a, a neighborhood party, a bigger party, a work party, you know there's a tendency to want to isolate, pull ourselves in and not go out. And in the recovery world, you know triggers are a bad word. Let's not get triggered.
Speaker 2:Um um, so I think that I want to call like bullshit on that yeah like I really do.
Speaker 2:I think at the beginning yeah, I think at the beginning yes there's a kind of self-protection where, when you're going through um, when, when you're with the first few days when you're, you know you're not drinking, or the first week and a half when you're not drinking, two weeks, yes, okay, all right, okay, let's protect ourselves, let's get through that period of when your body is detoxifying, but let's not avoid triggers after that that's really interesting because I so Eliza's a coach also like me, so I know, at the beginning for me I think I naturally, like you said, I did isolate a bit and at that point I wasn't really talking to anyone on the same journey.
Speaker 1:So that was just something I did and I had to then, as I went on, make a conscious decision to push myself. But with clients I find that it varies. So when you're, you know, saying after about two weeks, what does that look like? Because for some people it can be too much going to a party.
Speaker 2:Right, okay, oh, for sure.
Speaker 2:So I'm not saying go out there and be like the partier, like you were, and just do it without alcohol.
Speaker 2:I'm saying, gently, put yourself back in situations that you believe may trigger you to drink, because in life we are going to be in those situations and we don't want to avoid them and we don't want to be scared of alcohol. We don't want to, we want to trust ourselves. So, um, if we can be uncomfortable and not drink, if we can put ourselves into areas of discomfort and and go, whoa, actually I did that without alcohol and it wasn't so bad and and yes, I did have a craving, I did, but I got through it. Well, it just fortifies you, it just builds you up, it just, it's just, it's so powerful to turn those triggers into almost learning moments about yourself or signals that are telling you something that you need to work on, instead of like let's, let's break them down, let's do them. I just think that we don't want to. We want to live more freely, and if we avoid things because of alcohol, it has too much power.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, that it kind of sounds a bit like I'm really big into cognitive behavior therapy, doing things in little tiny steps and it's a lot of those lines. Yeah, you put yourself in the situation as a small step, you can always remove yourself, like the thing I used to do was go to a party and leave after an hour, and it is. It's building up that well, there's momentum pride, trust in yourself to be able to do these things. So I really, I really like that and and the problem with isolating is it become, can become, bigger and bigger that's right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it can become bigger and bigger until your sobriety, which I don't even use that word, but so your sobriety looks like pretty bloody miserable. Yeah, you know, um where you you're isolated and you're afraid to do anything because you might drink yeah um, so I'm saying let's, let's hit it, let's hit it on like let's, let let's do the things that we didn't think that we could do without alcohol earlier than we think that you know, like gently, gently, just a little bit, like you said, with I like to call it scaffolding.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:With the right kind of scaffolding.
Speaker 1:Yeah. You know, yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know we both know this tactic called a buddy, a plan and an excuse. So you go into these, you go at you. First of all, I always like to talk about visualization. You go into something, visualizing yourself happy and relaxed. You go with what are you wearing? What do you? You know, you visualize beforehand. You go and you're safe and you're happy, you're relaxed. You have a non-alcoholic drink in your hand and you just like relax and you hang out. Then you and you visualize that quite like, how did you get there?
Speaker 2:You visualize the whole thing because your mind doesn't know that it's not real. There's a part of your mind that does know that it's not real, but a lot of your mind doesn't. So it's like real practice, yeah, um, and that works. It's like a violinist, um, going over scales or music or whatever. Or or a football player going over drills and their head. It really works. And then, um, yeah, and then to tell somebody that you're not drinking, like, set yourself up, scaffold your, but don't not go. You know, like a buddy, you tell someone that you're not drinking. A plan which is like visualization Um, when am I going to leave? Um, what excuses am I going to use that I'm not drinking or excuse is probably you know why. What are you going to tell people? Like at the beginning I would say, oh, I'm taking, I'm just taking a short break from alcohol and then later I said it was it felt so good, I just kept going and then you know.
Speaker 2:So that kind of planning. Where am I? What am I going to do if I start feeling like I have it, like I want to drink? How am I going to remove myself? What am I going to do? Am I going to breathe? Am I going to leave, like a plan, and the excuse is I'm ready to go home now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it can be. You know, whatever's comfortable to you, it can be I'm on antibiotics, like whatever it is, or I need an early night. I've got a gym session at 6am, it just doesn't matter.
Speaker 2:Whatever feels right for you in the beginning exactly, exactly, because you know, if you look at that, uh, what is that adage? Connection is the opposite of addiction. Yeah, well, if we take connection away, if we take socialization away and community away, then we're taking out a really fundamental piece of how to you know how to not drink, like we're taking out a really fundamental piece of how to you know how to not drink, like we're taking away the connection and the community.
Speaker 1:Absolutely yeah, and it's so right, you know. And then I've had people say, well, this sucks because it's so boring or, you know, is it worth it? And it actually takes work, and we will talk about the, you know, friendship side of things, but it is something that I've had to work at to make my life really fulfilling and joyful. You know, yes, there's a bit of a change, so I've worked at it, and so just sitting back and waiting for the world to change because we've stopped drinking, it's not going to cut it. So I love what you're saying. You know, start to get out there in small, comfortable steps, practice.
Speaker 2:Fake it a little bit. Fake Like, if you put a smile on your face, actually the hormones go through your body. It tells you that you're safe. I remember doing a heavy yoga practice. I remember doing a heavy yoga practice and the the the teacher said smile during the most uncomfortable position because it tells your body and mind that you're safe and it allows you to stay in that position. It's the same thing here. It's like doing an exercise. Smile, tell your body you're safe. You know, tell your body you're going to look at your mind, that you're going to look after we can leave. We can leave whenever you want. We're just trying this out. We're just seeing what it's like. But fake this Like. If you have to fake a smile, fake a smile.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like it's not being out of integrity, I think, to sort of like try on different things, you know. Try on being smiley and happy when inside you're a little bit nervous, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely yeah, and it just it makes so much sense and I remember I still do it. You know, if something comes up, a social event, and I'm like I really push myself out of that comfort zone, my comfort zone, and like recently I went to a friend's gathering and I've been sort of umming and ahhing. I never I pretty much always leave feeling so much better, like once I've been, I really end up. I cut my time short if I need to, but there's I can't even recall a time where I've gone. I wish I hadn't gone, because that connection, like you said, is so important and that's a way that I keep friendships alive. But you also mentioned the discomfort and I think that's very, very important, because in life we work so hard to get away from discomfort. I mean, that's the bottom line for so many issues in our lives is that we don't want to feel uncomfortable. So a big part of what we've learned is learning to feel that. That's the clue, that's the answer.
Speaker 2:You know, what's curious about socialising and I coach this a lot is that when you go to a party, when you go to a new restaurant, when you go to or even a restaurant you've been to before, but you, you're going there without drinking and you're socializing. When you're in a new situation, it takes 20 minutes for you to acclimatize. It takes 20 minutes of discomfort to acclimatize, and that's when we use alcohol to get through the first 20 minutes right of the discomfort of socialization. Especially if you have a bit of social anxiety, like I do, that first 20 minutes can seem a little agonizing. But guess what? That same 20 minutes that the alcohol takes to come in and and do it, it do what it does.
Speaker 2:It would go away, naturally if you just did the same 20 minutes and sort of faked it to make, to made it you know what I mean. Like what's more fake, you putting on a smile and walking in and doing it, or using an addictive neurotoxin to make you feel more comfortable. So they're both fake. You know what? I or they're both, they're both not real in a way, but who cares?
Speaker 2:we can do that and teach our body that we can get through that discomfort yeah so and we can do that earlier than we think.
Speaker 2:That's what I'm saying Embrace that, embrace the trigger. Or if you get a trigger and let's say you do drink, don't avoid that trigger again. Let's work on what triggered you to drink and you did drink, because that is where all the information is. Let's use it Like I love that, if we get to the community and the connection aspect of it, I think that if we can get that, because so many people are afraid of losing their friends, of losing their community, of losing where they go you know they might stop at a bar on the way home every day. They're afraid of losing that. That might be their only connection, uh, like outside of their home or work, you know, um, and they're, everyone that I talked to is so afraid of losing that. So if we can be and and they're, they don't think they can do that. They don't think they can do it once they quit drinking. But I'm saying maybe you can yeah absolutely, if you hit the head.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know, the irony is like I, towards the end of my drinking career, I isolated. So ultimately, the the you drink, the more isolated you become.
Speaker 2:You're so right, megan? Yeah, because you take yourself out of situations. Yeah, or you avoid doing things because there isn't going to be alcohol there, or because you're feeling cut over, or because you don't want people yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, couldn't drink at the pace I wanted, you know it it was. It was very isolating and um, and so, yeah, what, what? What do you want? Like I did, I want to be isolated and drinking, or did I want to feel the discomfort of not knowing, not knowing? You know, how will I have friendship groups? How will this work, but not drink? Right, so, yeah, right, so, yeah, I picked, I picked a. They're both hard. I picked a different hard. That was, um, that's ultimately turned out to be the best thing ever and we have, we have ideas on how to, you know, build these communities.
Speaker 1:Um, it doesn't have to be naturally. I think you'll find with your group of friends what works and what doesn't. And I always say to my clients you know, yes, I don't have a relationship with a couple of people I used to drink with, but that's, that's okay, because when I looked at it, we only had drinking in common. Anyone else like that. We went deeper. We've, we remain connected and and I have actively worked at, and and they have too at connecting over things like brunch, uh, like going for walks, like the other night I went to a movie with one of my friends. We do, really, we do fun things that are healthy, that aren't around drinking and it takes some time going. Oh, I'm feeling a bit uncomfortable or isolated. I know I'll reach out to a friend, you know. Just something like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. And yeah, I mean in my experience, the energy with some friendships do change. It does change. And you know, mel Robbins, I think I was listening to her on a podcast and she was talking about like the three pillars of friendship which are here. I wrote them down, the three pillars of friendship. Proximity, which a lot of people like we don't have proximity but somehow we do have proximity through Zoom and because we work together. But timing of life, like you know, things like like what is the timing of our life? She says, like you know, kindergarten children up all the way through school, all the way through college, you're with your same age group in the same stage of life. So it's very easy to have friendship like that. But the third pillar is energy. Energy, what energy you bring, and when you quit drinking, your energy does change. And the energy of the people you want to be with changes. Excuse me, yeah, the energy of the people that you want to be with.
Speaker 1:It changes, everything changes connection is, I would say, the most important thing for me. So I've got beautiful friends that I'm still friends with. I have my work friends who I love, like different friends, different things. I I have a few things I do locally we have a meetup group in Sydney, that kind of thing but I also have a big connection online with people that are in the same place as me, with not drinking like us, like coaches, like people on this journey. That's been massive.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I remember when I woke up the morning after my last bout of drinking and I was looking on Instagram and I might have mentioned this in my last talk with you on this podcast but I felt very alone and very isolated and like I was probably the only person in the world which, of course, I wasn't waking up on New Year's Day feeling that disgusting. And I looked on Instagram and I found a community it was like called the, the sober gals or sober or something, and I was like they all looked like. I was like, oh wow, I mean, you can look like that and be sober like you can. It all looked very, it all looked quite beautiful and amazing and I wanted to know all of these people. And that's how I discovered creating community online. That was so I didn't realize. I didn't realize until I found that that it was so important for me to meet other women and men who I could say me too, me too, me too, me too, me too. It just made such a huge difference.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, we, megan and I, have started a group called connect af af, standing for alcohol free, and you don't have to be alcohol free to be in it. Um, but it's such a beautiful community, um, and we have two um zooms. Uh, zoom chats a week, group chats a week, and we talk about whatever we want to talk essentially, um, sometimes it's content, um, like like we could talk about triggers in one of them, like we could have a whole thing about triggers or about um so many different things to do with living an alcohol-free life. So, yeah, we meet twice a week.
Speaker 1:Uh, megan does one zoom and I do the other, and it's great, it's called Connect AF it is so good and I think it's um just such an important whatever the community looks like, an important part of this journey, and um all information will be in the show notes so people can find the links. There's a link to Connect AF under my name and then Bella's got her groups that she runs because there's there's something out there for everyone, whatever.
Speaker 2:There is. Yeah, Whatever you this is a space that is growing. This is a space that is growing.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Like some people really want like, like an LGBTQ space, and there isn't that. If you and there is that you can find that online Some people want, you know, a space. That is like I'm saying specifically for how they identify. Our space is for everybody. We're just a really beautiful, cozy, wonderful friend group and the thing that we have in common is that either we are not drinking like but we did, or we're working on it, you know, or maybe some, some people are working towards moderation. They're trying to figure it out, but everybody has this in common yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1:You know, what I love also about having a group like this is it helped me in the initial when we were talking about the socializing, and I often say it to my clients. It's if you go to say you go into a wedding that you kind of have to go to but you're feeling very reluctant, I would say to them if you're really struggling, pop into the bathroom, text your group, you know, get, get, yeah, get someone's going to be there. This is the beauty of having people all around the world. Someone will always be at the other end and just say I've popped in the bathroom, I need some support, you know, and and it's that's right, it's amazing, you know that really helped me and still does help me If I'm doing something that's I love to step out of my comfort zone. Love-hate relationship there is, you know, feel the discomfort, but I will tell some of my you know a group or some people on this journey with me. I'll tell them, you know, I'm feeling scared and somehow it gives me the confidence.
Speaker 2:That's right, saying it out loud. Saying it out loud is so amazing, so amazing. Uh, it somehow brings the um, that that struggle, um, down by 50%. Just reaching out Um, and and that's that's really remarkable, because having someone who's been through it and doing it with you is really, it's beautiful. It's a beautiful thing.
Speaker 1:It is, it's that we're not alone. Like you said, that day you woke up and felt so alone. I did the same thing as soon as my first break from alcohol. I got straight on the internet and looked for a group, and it was before. Well, I'd never looked before. So I looked for something in internet and looked for a group, and it was before well, I'd never looked before. So I looked for something in Australia and there was a group run by someone called Rebecca Weller, and it was just a 90-day program. It was no. There was no live interaction with other people, but just having something daily to read and connect with, knowing that someone had put it together who was on the same journey. Just suddenly I wasn't alone.
Speaker 2:Huge, huge, yeah, huge. It just makes an enormous difference. You know, doing this alone is really hard. Like what does what's her name, Laura McCallum, say? You know you can't do this alone, but you have to do it. Yes, you know what I mean. Like something like that. That's one of her nine things I can't remember.
Speaker 1:I have the book that's in the book push off from here, which I've actually that's it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, push off from here. Yeah, so it's one. If you look at the chapters, it's the.
Speaker 1:You can't do it alone. Chapter six and chapter seven Only you can do it.
Speaker 2:That's right. So community is really, really important and there are tons of communities out there. We have one, laura McCallum has one. Yeah, we're excited because we started ours at the beginning of December and I love it. I love our community. Yeah, for me, for me it was, it was uh, I would say, one of the top, top, top things belonging, feeling like I belong, yeah yeah, and I think belongings, that, or acceptance, is like the number one need that's right, and it took me a while in the first group that I was in to feel like I belonged and I realized that that was something that was in me.
Speaker 2:It wasn't that I didn't belong, it was that in me I never had felt like I belonged. That was sort of like a core wound, you could say, and so that ended up being something that I have had to work on, you know, um, but it presented itself very early on in these groups. I don't feel like I belong and I would look for excuses why I didn't belong and then once in a group, I said I don't feel like I belong.
Speaker 2:I just don't feel like I belong and in saying it, like you were saying before, and voicing it, I started fullfilling, because how many people in that group didn't feel like they really belonged? It bonded us together oh, that's so cool.
Speaker 1:I love that. Yeah, and so for everyone listening, you can find us in the show notes. Like I said, isabella's got her information there. I've got mine.
Speaker 2:You will see the link, and we'd love to hear from anyone and everyone yeah, tell us how you belong, tell us how you found your community, how you connect. We would love, we would love to hear, I would love to read the you know response to that. And also, um, if you want to like, if you don't have time to look at the show notes, you can go to my website, elizaparkinsoncom and there's a tab that says connect af. And so, if you're interested, um, just put in your name there. That doesn't mean that you're signing up and paying or whatever. Just put in your name there and we'll see that, uh, that you, that you've shown interest awesome.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for being here today, eliza. I'm so happy to so nice and uh, I will have you back another time and we can uh dig into something else yeah, looking forward to it, looking forward to it.
Speaker 2:Thank you, megan.
